Room Conversation, July 16, 1968 Montreal

Pradyumna: What is that type of pleasure that is material pleasure, that a person feels engaged in material pursuit. He feel some kind of pleasure. It’s not very much pleasure, but it’s some pleasure. What is that pleasure made of? Because if he is enjoying sense gratification…

Prabhupāda: That is pleasure. That is material pleasure. Material pleasure means sex pleasure. That’s all. The end of material pleasure, the topmost material pleasure, is sex pleasure. So all these materialists, they are trying to get pleasure from the sex life—in this way, that way, that way, that way, that way. That’s all. Because they have no other information.

Material pleasure means sex pleasure. Sex pleasure, tongue pleasure. They have manufactured so many things. That gentleman was sitting and asking, “Can I smoke?” The tongue is agitating for… “Please, please give me one cigarette. One cigarette.” He became disturbed. And we said, “No. You cannot smoke.” This is material pleasure. You train up your senses in such a way that it becomes addicted. It cannot get out of the entanglement.

So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness will save you. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham [SB 7.9.45].

They are all explained in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. The material pleasure means sexual intercourse. That’s all. That is the sum and substance of pleasure. That’s all. You’ll find everywhere two: one male and female, one male and female, male and female. Either legitimate or illegitimate. Either human being or animal or birds or beast, that male and female, male and female, male and female. This is material pleasure. And unless one is strongly equipped in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, it is not possible to give up. That is the test. It is not possible.

Therefore Kṛṣṇa is Madana-mohana. He can captivate even the Cupid. This is Cupid’s business, attraction of male and female. And when that Kṛṣṇa attracts you, you forget this Cupid attraction. Therefore He is known as Madana-mohana.
jayatāṁ suratau paṅgor
mama manda-mater gatī
mat-sarvasva-padāmbhojau
rādhā-madana-mohanau
[Cc Ādi 1.15]
This is the beginning.

Śivānanda: When do we become attracted? When do we begin to become attracted?

Prabhupāda: Forget that. You are attracted. That you take account of. When you become diseased, that is useless. You are diseased. Take medicine. There is no necessity of asking when you became diseased. You are diseased. Take medicine. That’s all. What is the use of tracing the history? Everything has his history, that’s all right. But my immediate necessity is that “I am diseased. I want to be cured. Give me some medicine.”

But there is history. The history is this. Just like disease. You have fallen victim of disease. That means you have given chance to the infection. That’s all. That is the sum and substance of disease. You are infected with some disease. That means you have given chance for that infection.

There was a story in a medical journal, “Typhoid Mary.” Typhoid Mary… One girl, whenever she was present everyone was being infected with typhoid. Then she was examined, that she is full of typhoid germs. But she was immune. But she infected wherever she went. The medical journal reported. So we should be careful not being infected. And that how you can become free from infection? These four rules: “Don’t have this, don’t have this, don’t have this, don’t have this.”

Then you are free from infection. So you should be careful from being infected. There is no use tracing out the history where you became infected. You should not be infected. That should be your business. And as you are now infected, you try to avoid the causes of infection and take the medicine; you become cured.

Some prasādam? So Annapurna, you have got some news?

Annapurna: I got a letter from my father. I have a letter from my father.

Prabhupāda: So is that all right?

Annapurna: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So what is our next program? [chuckles] That letter is encouraging?

Annapurna: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That’s all right.
[pause] So on behalf of Kṛṣṇa we have to canvass with folded hands and with all humility, “Please come to our temple and hear.” He sādhavā sakalam eva vihāya dūrād caitanya-candra-caraṇe kurutānurāgam [Caitanya-candrāmṛta].
All right. [pause]

Devotee: This rule, not to gamble, no gambling…

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Devotee: This rule, “No gambling,” does this also include speculation…

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Devotee: …various types?

Prabhupāda: Speculation is gambling.

Additional:

So it is to be understood they are simply wasting. Oh, how miserable it is. They get the opportunity, and they are simply wasting for sense gratification just like cats and dogs. Whole day working, whole day laboring. Why? Sense gratification. That is also in the hog society. Eating stool, living in nasty place, and they have got very good facility for sex. Is that the end of life?
So Bhāgavata says, nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājaṁ nṛloke kāṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye [SB 5.5.1].

You are working so hard, and the end should not be simply sense gratification. Sense gratification you can get in hog society, dog society, without any, I mean to say, expert qualification. That is… Viṣayaḥ khalu sarvataḥ syāt. Viṣaya means this sense gratificatory business, you will have in any life—in bird’s life, in dog’s life, in cat’s life. So do you think that human life is also meant for that purpose? Then what is the meaning of civilization? Is that civilization? If the end of life is the same, just like cats and dogs, is it civilization?

They do not know what is civilization. They have forgotten. They think that eating very nicely in a palatable dish, that is civilization. But eating is eating. And if you eat… If you are hungry, anything satisfies you. That is eating. Finish. You can eat. Sleeping: when you are fast asleep, you do not know whether you are on the nice building in a nice apartment. You are dreaming that you are thrown into the ocean. Sleeping. So simply for nice arrangement for sleeping, is that civilization? [break]

[indistinct]. At least, if one understands that “This is my business. My business is not to work hard and end it by sense gratification. This is not my business.” That is saṁsiddhi. That is success. If at least one understands this aim of life, even little understands, he gets next human body. That is guaranteed. At least, he is not going to get any cats’ and dogs’ body. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā.

Śucīnāṁ śrīmatāṁ gehe yoga-bhraṣṭo ‘bhijāyate [Bg 6.41].
When Arjuna inquired that if a man cannot execute this yoga system, bhakti-yoga system, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if it is half finished or one-fourth finished, or ten percent finished, not complete finished, then what is the result? He is good for nothing? No. Kṛṣṇa says, “No.” Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt. Even a little understood, it can save him from the greatest danger.

And śucīnāṁ śrīmatāṁ gehe yoga-bhraṣṭo sanjayate [Bg 6.41]. If one is not successful in this life, then he is given another chance next life. Where? Śucīnāṁ: in nice, I mean, transcendentalist, brāhmaṇa or Vaiṣṇava devotee or pious man, in his family. Or less than, if he is less qualified, then he is given a chance to get his birth in a rich family. Both the families. In rich family he has no economic problem. And in a pious family he gets direct opportunity to, I mean to say, advance his past Kṛṣṇa consciousness again. So in these two families he gets another chance.

But unfortunately, those who are born in rich family, they immediately give up all principles of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. “Oh, I have got so much money without any labor. Let me enjoy.” This is māyā. He does not think… Because he has no education that “You have got this opportunity that you have no economic problem. Take this opportunity for advancing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Engage your full time to become a devotee.” Nobody educates him. The poor boy or poor fellow is misguided. He gets his friend, “Oh you have got so much money. Let us enjoy.” Eat, drink, be merry and enjoy. So he becomes again cats and dogs.